Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
make sense to me.
Rob

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo <> wrote:
>  The policies are not the same.  Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>  We've been through this before.  JA's policy has more than the other
> companies have included in their policies.
> Deb
>
>
>
> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>
>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>
>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>
>>>> Gary
>>>
>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>
>>>
>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
make sense to me.
Rob

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo <> wrote:
>  The policies are not the same.  Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>  We've been through this before.  JA's policy has more than the other
> companies have included in their policies.
> Deb
>
>
>
> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>
>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>
>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>
>>>> Gary
>>>
>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>
>>>
>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Hunh?

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 3:15 PM, Gary Goltz <> wrote:
> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:55 AM
> To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
make sense to me.
Rob

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo <> wrote:
>  The policies are not the same.  Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>  We've been through this before.  JA's policy has more than the other
> companies have included in their policies.
> Deb
>
>
>
> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>
>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>
>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>
>>>> Gary
>>>
>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>
>>>
>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Hunh?

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 3:15 PM, Gary Goltz <> wrote:
> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:55 AM
> To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Rob,
In insurance bigger doesn't mean better but it usually means less
expensive. You have to read the coverages, limits and most of all the
exclusions.
Have you read your HO insurance policy?
Deb

On 10/6/2010 3:33 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
> Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
> million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
> best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
> which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
> individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
> make sense to me.
> Rob
>
> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo<> wrote:
>> The policies are not the same. Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>> We've been through this before. JA's policy has more than the other
>> companies have included in their policies.
>> Deb
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Gary
>>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
make sense to me.
Rob

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo <> wrote:
>  The policies are not the same.  Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>  We've been through this before.  JA's policy has more than the other
> companies have included in their policies.
> Deb
>
>
>
> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>
>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>
>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>
>>>> Gary
>>>
>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>
>>>
>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Hunh?

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 3:15 PM, Gary Goltz <> wrote:
> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:55 AM
> To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Rob,
In insurance bigger doesn't mean better but it usually means less
expensive. You have to read the coverages, limits and most of all the
exclusions.
Have you read your HO insurance policy?
Deb

On 10/6/2010 3:33 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
> Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
> million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
> best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
> which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
> individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
> make sense to me.
> Rob
>
> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo<> wrote:
>> The policies are not the same. Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>> We've been through this before. JA's policy has more than the other
>> companies have included in their policies.
>> Deb
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Gary
>>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 1:15 PM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!

Eight hours ago, I was going to let that one slide, but now I think my initial reaction was wrong.

I don't know whose four fingers are pointing back at me, but it sure isn't any on my fingers. You, more than anyone else on this list, should know that I practice what I preach. And I preach what I preach because I am tired of Judo being maligned by the American public, and being maligned because we have not learned a darn thing from the past.

We need a new Judo culture. We need to rebrand Judo. We need a Judo industry. We need to step outside that box we've been so attached to for the last 40 years. And we need to look around us and figure out what every other art is doing to grow. Better pedagogy, better coaches, better rules, and better facilities will help. I'm doing these things in my club. I'm encouraging others to look beyond their comfort zones. But with the USJA, and the other two orgs as well, in spite of a few good people, it's still the same sorry old model that gets us nowhere, but a step closer to extinction. Case in point: how in the world and why in the world do we put up with the idiotic rules the IJF shoved down our throats without revolting? Isn't anyone awake at the wheel?

So, yes, we're still primarily a bunch of amateurs trying to play with the pros, and it need not be like that...but it is.


> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.

_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
make sense to me.
Rob

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo <> wrote:
>  The policies are not the same.  Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>  We've been through this before.  JA's policy has more than the other
> companies have included in their policies.
> Deb
>
>
>
> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>
>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>
>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>
>>>> Gary
>>>
>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>
>>>
>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Hunh?

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 3:15 PM, Gary Goltz <> wrote:
> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:55 AM
> To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Rob,
In insurance bigger doesn't mean better but it usually means less
expensive. You have to read the coverages, limits and most of all the
exclusions.
Have you read your HO insurance policy?
Deb

On 10/6/2010 3:33 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
> Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
> million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
> best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
> which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
> individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
> make sense to me.
> Rob
>
> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo<> wrote:
>> The policies are not the same. Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>> We've been through this before. JA's policy has more than the other
>> companies have included in their policies.
>> Deb
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Gary
>>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 1:15 PM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!

Eight hours ago, I was going to let that one slide, but now I think my initial reaction was wrong.

I don't know whose four fingers are pointing back at me, but it sure isn't any on my fingers. You, more than anyone else on this list, should know that I practice what I preach. And I preach what I preach because I am tired of Judo being maligned by the American public, and being maligned because we have not learned a darn thing from the past.

We need a new Judo culture. We need to rebrand Judo. We need a Judo industry. We need to step outside that box we've been so attached to for the last 40 years. And we need to look around us and figure out what every other art is doing to grow. Better pedagogy, better coaches, better rules, and better facilities will help. I'm doing these things in my club. I'm encouraging others to look beyond their comfort zones. But with the USJA, and the other two orgs as well, in spite of a few good people, it's still the same sorry old model that gets us nowhere, but a step closer to extinction. Case in point: how in the world and why in the world do we put up with the idiotic rules the IJF shoved down our throats without revolting? Isn't anyone awake at the wheel?

So, yes, we're still primarily a bunch of amateurs trying to play with the pros, and it need not be like that...but it is.


> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.

_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Karl Geis recently told me amateur comes from amore which means to do
something for the love of it. For judo to move forward we do need fresh
ideas and to be open to thinking out of the box, I agree. However to take
pot shots at the folks currently working hard at running clubs, holding
tournaments, clinics, and promoting judo for the love of it seems
counterproductive to your argument.



-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:57 PM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 1:15 PM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!

Eight hours ago, I was going to let that one slide, but now I think my
initial reaction was wrong.

I don't know whose four fingers are pointing back at me, but it sure isn't
any on my fingers. You, more than anyone else on this list, should know that
I practice what I preach. And I preach what I preach because I am tired of
Judo being maligned by the American public, and being maligned because we
have not learned a darn thing from the past.

We need a new Judo culture. We need to rebrand Judo. We need a Judo
industry. We need to step outside that box we've been so attached to for the
last 40 years. And we need to look around us and figure out what every other
art is doing to grow. Better pedagogy, better coaches, better rules, and
better facilities will help. I'm doing these things in my club. I'm
encouraging others to look beyond their comfort zones. But with the USJA,
and the other two orgs as well, in spite of a few good people, it's still
the same sorry old model that gets us nowhere, but a step closer to
extinction. Case in point: how in the world and why in the world do we put
up with the idiotic rules the IJF shoved down our throats without revolting?
Isn't anyone awake at the wheel?

So, yes, we're still primarily a bunch of amateurs trying to play with the
pros, and it need not be like that...but it is.


> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the
water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan.
The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.

_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.

Who is this guy and what's his evidence?

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 5:26 AM, Paul Fracchia <> wrote:

> Dear Joan,
> Great job on Growing Judo.
> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
> karateka, however he is a thief.
> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
> Paul Fracchia
> life member
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Joan,

I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
their priorities.

Rob Thornton

On Mon, Oct 4, 2010 at 1:28 PM, Joan Love <> wrote:
>
> The October issue of USJA's Growing Judo is now available at:
>
> http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/GrowingJudo2010_10.pdf
>
> Please forward to all interested parties!  :-)
>
> Thank you,
>
>
>
> Joan Love
> Vice-President, USJA
> Editor, Growing Judo http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm
>
> _______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Anyone can be sued, of course. But I don't think USJA is at particular risk -- the accusation didn't come from, or through, USJA, and the USJA president very properly demanded to know what evidence might exist for the truth or falsity of the accusation.

-- Carl
.
----- Original Message -----
From: Ben Bergwerf
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack
of judgement.

Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize.
This was widely disseminated.

BB


At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>Dear Joan,
>Great job on Growing Judo.
>I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>karateka, however he is a thief.
>I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>Paul Fracchia
>life member.com
_______________________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gary,

CYA. Too much is unknown about either party. Now USJA appears to be the
pickle in the middle!


In a message dated 10/5/2010 11:03:29 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
writes:

Agreed

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:25 AM, Ben Bergwerf <> wrote:

> This could be a serious problem. If not true, USJA could be sued. If
true, the background check was not done properly and there was a lack of
judgement.
>
> Needs attention. Paul Fracchia needs to substantiate, or apologize. This
was widely disseminated.
>
> BB
>
>
> At 05:26 AM 10/5/2010 -0700, Paul Fracchia wrote:
>> Dear Joan,
>> Great job on Growing Judo.
>> I see you have a karate division with Grant Campbell. He is an excellent
>> karateka, however he is a thief.
>> I had to work closely with him during my AAU days and he stole
thousands of
>> dollars. I am only telling you this to beware of him handling any
funds. The
>> USJA doesn't need any more problems.
>> Yours in the interest of the USJA,
>> Paul Fracchia
>> life member
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I thought pedagogy got thrown out a few years ago....

On Tue, Oct 5, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>
>> Joan,
>>
>> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
>> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
>> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
>> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
>> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
>> their priorities.
>>
>> Rob Thornton
>
> I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."








-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Lafon <>
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo <>
Sent: Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09 pm
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available



On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:19 AM, Rob Thornton wrote:

> Joan,
>
> I'm happy to see the new edition, but concerned with the sheer irony
> of how it's laid out. We get messages from the great Jim bregman and
> from Barry Southam about how to grow Judo, alongside.......a new
> KARATE division? What the hell? I thought USJA got past that with
> Porter! A sport jujitsu program is bad enough. USJA needs to reasses
> their priorities.
>
> Rob Thornton

I was thinking the same thing. Of course, it is far easier to bring in other
groups than it is to fix the sport, the rules, the pedagogy, the marketing
program (I know, what marketing program?), the organization, etc.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. >>I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.

Clueless seems to be in fashion.  I have given up.  
My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member.  The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel.  Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out.  But the politics was sickening.  Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.  
I'm still playing- still teaching.  I am not sure if its Judo anymore.  I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well....  I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out.  I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it.  That was the product.  No thanks.
I am just saying.  

--- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:

From: Gerald Lafon <>
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. You're missing the point, it's all about growing judo. These karate guys want to do judo in their dojos. They are serious, have the mats, and see us as an expansion. They like our service, insurance, and database management. Yes we'll get some additional revenue (which is a good thing) but most importantly we'll get them going on judo. So please embrace them. It's what Kano would have done!

Gary

Sent from my iPhone

(909) 702-3250

On Oct 5, 2010, at 9:36 PM, Jonathan Jeffer <> wrote:

>
>>> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the >>USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are >>supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify >>because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
>
> Clueless seems to be in fashion. I have given up.
> My membership has lapsed except that I am in theory a life member. The last elections in the JA,and then IJF and the last assault on the rules finally made me throw in the towel. Its hard to get excited about a rules set that forbids everything. I even give the JA credit for finally getting my rank issues sorted out. But the politics was sickening. Finally the JA was willing and I was too fed up to pony up the several dollars for the past years sustaining dues that I'd missed.
> I'm still playing- still teaching. I am not sure if its Judo anymore. I can't promote anyone except for in-house club rank if they care. Learning lots of cool BJJ stuff, and Sambo as well.... I don't know about anyone else but I think our whole dojo has opted out. I think most of em feel more or less the same way. Wasn't like I never said anything about it. That was the product. No thanks.
> I am just saying.
>
> --- On Tue, 10/5/10, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> From: Gerald Lafon <>
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
> To: "Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo" <>
> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 10:12 PM
>
>
> On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:
>
>>
>> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."
>
> I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or clueless.
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that
product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. I concur!

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of
Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 2010 11:41 PM
To:
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available

In the next issue of "Growing Judo," I hope to have an update from Bill
Montgomery on the coaching curriculum in general and on the program that
Sid
Kelly had created to develop randori skills and improve retention of
beginners in judo.

Personally, I think they are both VERY competent people, and not lazy at
all! :-)

Joan Love
Vice-President, USJA
Editor, Growing Judo _http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm_
(http://www.usja-judo.org/GrowingJudo/index.htm)




In a message dated 10/5/2010 10:12:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
writes:


On Oct 5, 2010, at 6:59 PM, wrote:

>
> Maybe I should have said "Follow the Money."

I understand the "money" part. All orgs need money to function, and I
don't begrudge the USJA for needing money. However, I'd like to see us
improve
the one product we are supposed to be selling- Judo- and make money on that

product, rather than diversify because we are lazy, incompetent and/or
clueless.
_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Gerald, . . . I agree with you wholeheartedly, . . ! We have the same
situation here across Canada!

John Huntley

-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: October-06-10 11:55 AM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> We need to learn from others.
>
> Gary


Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.


_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon <> wrote:
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo" black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
make sense to me.
Rob

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo <> wrote:
>  The policies are not the same.  Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>  We've been through this before.  JA's policy has more than the other
> companies have included in their policies.
> Deb
>
>
>
> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>
>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>
>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>
>>>> Gary
>>>
>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>
>>>
>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Hunh?

On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 3:15 PM, Gary Goltz <> wrote:
> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:55 AM
> To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> We need to learn from others.
>>
>> Gary
>
>
> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Rob,
In insurance bigger doesn't mean better but it usually means less
expensive. You have to read the coverages, limits and most of all the
exclusions.
Have you read your HO insurance policy?
Deb

On 10/6/2010 3:33 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
> Debbie, maybe you better explain it to me. An org like AAU with a
> million members doesn't have better coverage than one with 8000 (at
> best). For that matter, the private martial arts insurance companies,
> which provide polices for schools and their customers, instead of the
> individual student paying, is worse than USA Judo/JA/JF?? That doesn't
> make sense to me.
> Rob
>
> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 2:25 PM, Judo<> wrote:
>> The policies are not the same. Compare coverages, limits and exclusions.
>> We've been through this before. JA's policy has more than the other
>> companies have included in their policies.
>> Deb
>>
>>
>>
>> On 10/6/2010 3:12 PM, Rob Thornton wrote:
>>> 8000 and falling....at least that will call themselves Judo clubs.
>>> There are plenty out there that do Judo without joining the orgs,
>>> because they don't feel like the orgs have anything new to offer them.
>>> AAU and private MA insurance comes out infinitely better than any of
>>> the three orgs. USJA could be funding - not supporting, but funding
>>> camps and clinics and offering general membership with no insurance
>>> for $10 a year. The only reason I can see that USJA keeps its puny
>>> insurance program is to beg and scrape to USA Judo's rules. Do we
>>> really need that just to run a local shiai? Of course not.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 6, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Gerald Lafon<>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Oct 6, 2010, at 9:28 AM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> We need to learn from others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Gary
>>>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>>>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
>>>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>>>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>>>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>>>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>>>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>>>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
>>>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. On Oct 6, 2010, at 1:15 PM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!

Eight hours ago, I was going to let that one slide, but now I think my initial reaction was wrong.

I don't know whose four fingers are pointing back at me, but it sure isn't any on my fingers. You, more than anyone else on this list, should know that I practice what I preach. And I preach what I preach because I am tired of Judo being maligned by the American public, and being maligned because we have not learned a darn thing from the past.

We need a new Judo culture. We need to rebrand Judo. We need a Judo industry. We need to step outside that box we've been so attached to for the last 40 years. And we need to look around us and figure out what every other art is doing to grow. Better pedagogy, better coaches, better rules, and better facilities will help. I'm doing these things in my club. I'm encouraging others to look beyond their comfort zones. But with the USJA, and the other two orgs as well, in spite of a few good people, it's still the same sorry old model that gets us nowhere, but a step closer to extinction. Case in point: how in the world and why in the world do we put up with the idiotic rules the IJF shoved down our throats without revolting? Isn't anyone awake at the wheel?

So, yes, we're still primarily a bunch of amateurs trying to play with the pros, and it need not be like that...but it is.


> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan. The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.

_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Karl Geis recently told me amateur comes from amore which means to do
something for the love of it. For judo to move forward we do need fresh
ideas and to be open to thinking out of the box, I agree. However to take
pot shots at the folks currently working hard at running clubs, holding
tournaments, clinics, and promoting judo for the love of it seems
counterproductive to your argument.



-----Original Message-----
From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:57 PM
To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available


On Oct 6, 2010, at 1:15 PM, Gary Goltz wrote:

> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!

Eight hours ago, I was going to let that one slide, but now I think my
initial reaction was wrong.

I don't know whose four fingers are pointing back at me, but it sure isn't
any on my fingers. You, more than anyone else on this list, should know that
I practice what I preach. And I preach what I preach because I am tired of
Judo being maligned by the American public, and being maligned because we
have not learned a darn thing from the past.

We need a new Judo culture. We need to rebrand Judo. We need a Judo
industry. We need to step outside that box we've been so attached to for the
last 40 years. And we need to look around us and figure out what every other
art is doing to grow. Better pedagogy, better coaches, better rules, and
better facilities will help. I'm doing these things in my club. I'm
encouraging others to look beyond their comfort zones. But with the USJA,
and the other two orgs as well, in spite of a few good people, it's still
the same sorry old model that gets us nowhere, but a step closer to
extinction. Case in point: how in the world and why in the world do we put
up with the idiotic rules the IJF shoved down our throats without revolting?
Isn't anyone awake at the wheel?

So, yes, we're still primarily a bunch of amateurs trying to play with the
pros, and it need not be like that...but it is.


> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the
water
> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan.
The
> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.

_____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe. Don't know if I agree with the analogy. Between PeeWee, HS, College,
Touch, Flag Football, hundreds of thousands play.

Maybe we're the Rugby of Martial Arts :(

On Thu, Oct 7, 2010 at 9:06 AM, Gary Goltz <> wrote:
> I always have said it's the football of the martial arts.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of Richard Porro
> Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2010 6:09 AM
> To: 'Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo'
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
> Has any ever thought that judo is just plain hard? It is easy to kick and
> punch air. It is easy to pad up and play touch with strikes. Judo is hard on
> the body. It is also cost prohibitive for new instructors. If it wasn't for
> Jim Haynes Friendswood judo never would have existed. He bought the mats. I
> have $5000 worth of used mats. Couldn't imagine what they would have been
> brand new. Usja needs some kind of partnership with finance company's to get
> new clubs up and running. How does it go, "build it and they will come".
>
> From a sport perspective, I would revamp all the rules to look more like a
> cross between sambo and bjj for the grass root level. This would encourage
> those arts to compete with us. The result bigger turn out for judo players,
> bjj players and sambo players. I have a player going thru referee training
> for judo but won't compete because he hates the rules, however he has a bjj
> tournament (never took a bjj class in his life) in a couple of weeks. He
> likes the rules better and hopefully when he throws them into
> unconsciousness he will announce he is a judo player.
>
> Nobody wants to change in this art. Nobody wants to do anything different.
> If a club (grass roots) wants to change the rules drastically turnout will
> either be discouraged by the coaches or uninteresting for the players.
>
> If you notice I hardly do any posting here. I am no longer as active in
> judo. I even lost interest in jujutsu. I find it more fun to hit with sticks
> (KALI) and incorporate my judo and jujutsu into that.
>
>
> Now, the ragging on me can begin.
>
>
> Richard Porro
>
> If it isn't full contact, it isn't martial arts!
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of
> Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2010 6:47 AM
> To:
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
> Some deeper thoughts need to go into Gerald's comments.
>
> It has been said that "if you keep doing what you have been doing, you will
> keep getting what you have been getting."
>
> What are we doing that is different?  What are we doing that is the same?
> Do we want to change?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Goltz <>
> To: 'Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo'
> <>
> Sent: Thu, Oct 7, 2010 4:01 am
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
>
> Karl Geis recently told me amateur comes from amore which means to do
> something for the love of it. For judo to move forward we do need fresh
> ideas and to be open to thinking out of the box, I agree.  However to take
> pot shots at the folks currently working hard at running clubs, holding
> tournaments, clinics, and promoting judo for the love of it seems
> counterproductive to your argument.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: judolist- [mailto:judolist-] On
> Behalf Of Gerald Lafon
> Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 11:57 PM
> To: Discussion of All Aspects of Traditional and Modern Judo
> Subject: Re: [JudoList] October Growing Judo now available
>
>
> On Oct 6, 2010, at 1:15 PM, Gary Goltz wrote:
>
>> When you point your finger remember 4 are pointing back at you!
>
> Eight hours ago, I was going to let that one slide, but now I think my
> initial reaction was wrong.
>
> I don't know whose four fingers are pointing back at me, but it sure isn't
> any on my fingers. You, more than anyone else on this list, should know that
> I practice what I preach. And I preach what I preach because I am tired of
> Judo being maligned by the American public, and being maligned because we
> have not learned a darn thing from the past.
>
> We need a new Judo culture. We need to rebrand Judo. We need a Judo
> industry. We need to step outside that box we've been so attached to for the
> last 40 years. And we need to look around us and figure out what every other
> art is doing to grow. Better pedagogy, better coaches, better rules, and
> better facilities will help. I'm doing these things in my club. I'm
> encouraging others to look beyond their comfort zones. But with the USJA,
> and the other two orgs as well, in spite of a few good people, it's still
> the same sorry old model that gets us nowhere, but a step closer to
> extinction. Case in point: how in the world and why in the world do we put
> up with the idiotic rules the IJF shoved down our throats without revolting?
> Isn't anyone awake at the wheel?
>
> So, yes, we're still primarily a bunch of amateurs trying to play with the
> pros, and it need not be like that...but it is.
>
>
>> Sure we do, but we don't. It's business, or more appropriately lack of
>> business, as usual. We've allowed various trends to blow us out of the
> water
>> since the 1960s without changing our m.o. First it was Bruce Lee and the
>> kung fu craze, then pro-karate on TV, then bjj and now mma. Nothing has
>> changed in Judo other than its emasculation via rule changes. We are still
>> largely a collection of small, amateurish clubs, led by "service to Judo"
>> black belts, operating out of borrowed facilities on crappy mats with no
>> modern pedagogy, and without any semblance of a national marketing plan.
> The
>> only thing remarkable is that we are still around...barely.
>
> _____________________________
___________________________________________________

Posted on the JudoList mailing list. Go to http://mail.chas-ma.com/mailman/listinfo/judolist_chas-ma.com to subscribe.